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Done foolin' around

This section is about Keydown Competition rigs or high performance competition base setups. If you have questions or information on how to maximize a competition setup, this is the place !

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crazytruker
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Done foolin' around

Post by crazytruker » Saturday, 22 December 2007, 16:18 PM

Hey Kidd. I am dropping this in the competition area because you have a comp. "burban" and know quite a bit it seems. I am done fooling around man. I can't do a base station because I live in an apartment. I'm not sure I want to buy a house in Colorado. It's really expensive out here. Plus I don't like the idea of a 30 year loan. That aside, I have been thinking about doing a suburban. Not so much for competition but for a mean skip talking mobile. Here is my dilemma...

What is required to get AC power? I want more than anything to hook my Browning Golden Eagle up and talk. Not to leave in the mobile, but to take it at times and key it on the mobile antenna system. I was thinking about getting a gas powered generator to throw in the back of the pick up to run the Browning and my tube amp (1kw). I even considered getting a trailer and attaching a telescoping mast to the front of the trailer which would be 6-10 feet when collapsed allowing me to leave it on the trailer in the standing position fully collapsed. The antenna would of been something easy like an Imax 2000 that I could break down into it's smaller unassembled sections and store in an on board box locked up on the trailer. Then attach the generator to the trailer and have a portable base station of sorts. I may be able to find a location that I could put ground rods into the ground and leave there so when I get to that location I can unhook the trailer, attach grounds to rods, attach antenna and key down. I am torn between the trailer and doing a suburban. I'm not totally sure I want an all AC suburban but I have to key that Browning man. It's killing me. Can 1 AC alternator be used to run the radio and amp? I'm not too sure about driving a pill amp with a tube rig. Can AC and DC alternators be used providing 2 different supplies of power inside the vehicle for such a set up like I am describing?

What I am after is talking on my Browning (perhaps not all the time but sometimes), a 2 hot antenna system phased 180 and at times changing the coax length to the front hot for a 270 degrees phase as situations call for, and a platform like the suburban offers to build and add to over time. I am thinking if I can find a decent older burban and get a 2 hot antenna system going, an additional HO alternator or 2 to start with accompanying batteries, and a couple thousand watts, I'll be set. At least for awhile I'll be set. I want to get back out there in DX land I am not fooling around. I am a mean cotton picka on the *Censored* and I want to build a *Censored* dropping platform and leave the ducks slobbering in their mics like I used to be able to. You can PM me if you want. *** Admin*** You can move this post if needed to a different topic thread.

Thanks.... Hammer stick tip toeing across these snow caps and I just got doooooooowwwwnnnn bye bye bye bye bye!!!!!!!


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ww228kidd
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Post by ww228kidd » Saturday, 22 December 2007, 16:53 PM

hummm...never used an external type antenna like useing a base antenna...
the AC deal is different AC that powers house equipment...
we use AC alternators the produce 3 phase at like 17 to 20VAC (estimated) then they are put into transformers that produce from 3200 to 6300VAC (depends on the tube you are running) then run into diodes and storing capacitors.....(lot more info on this type of setup, but i would be here all night typing)...alot of stuff goes into a AC mobile set ups...
BUT!! you can run the equipment that you have by using DC alternators to power the REDI-LINE motor inverters($700 each used)...then you can plug your radio and house amp into it...you will need an extra 200AMP alternator with a couple of extra batteries to power the motor inverters...
BUT you will spend too much money for the out come...
BUT you can use a generator with a trailer and get the same results...
BUT for the money spent on all that, you can get a good running 16pill or even more
its all in the amount you want to spend...
you can still set it up like MR WEED from Florida does....With a beam...he sets up in places and talks DX from his mobile sometimes...but he has a darn good base too..lol



do you a budget or amount of watts in mind?

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crazytruker
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Post by crazytruker » Saturday, 22 December 2007, 21:29 PM

Uh, I think I get the AC idea. So in a nut shell small ac volts are made at the alternator, sent to on board transformers to step it up the the high voltage needed for the tubes. Therefore the tube amps in an AC mobile are essentially dead amps as far as a built in power supply. The voltage step up is made externally from the amps and fed into the amps. I think that's what you are saying... So what's the advantage of that over amps that have the transformers built in? Is the advantage in that you can run all types of various tube amps that require different supply voltages and the generator motors give you the flexibility to raise and lower the voltage? This stuff is intriguing.

I think you may be right as to stay with dc. It seems easier. My plan is to be on the lookout for an older Suburban. I will bond everything. and get at least one antenna running on it mounted near the rear of the roof so as to leave room forward for a second hot in due time. Since I have a 2- 2879 texas star 350, I thought I would use that as my driver amp to drive whatever straight pill amp will take it the best. Straight 4 or 6, I'm not sure of that yet. And over time keep on adding... More alternators and batteries and whatever amp will take the amp that is being driven by the 2 pill. So maybe something like the 2 pill driving a 6 pill then that driving a 16 or whatever will take that 2 to 6 drive. This is my plan anyhow. I'm not looking to do 50,000 watts but I am looking to key down on the bowl to let them pluckers know that I am out there. And it's your fault LOL. Ever since I saw you did the Suburban thing I have been semi interested. I think the time to begin is now. I don't care if the burban is a cross country driver. As long as it runs good without needing a re built engine and I can get up on one of the mountains out here when DX rolls I'll be happy. Here comes the monster.... LOL

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ww228kidd
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Post by ww228kidd » Saturday, 22 December 2007, 21:50 PM

cool....


and to answer your question about the AC amplifiers...
in any AC tube type amplifier, you will need high voltage.and low voltage..we use the AC alternators to power the transformers needed to feed the tubes to produce the RF (high voltage)....we use the DC alternators to power the REDI-LINE motor inverters to produce your house voltage of 120VAC...then run into another voltage transformer will light the filament of the tubes only...
you will never be able to just run 120V house voltage amplifiers in a mobile....only the small ones that dont pull much...
you can run a (3) 3-500z box with low cost and produce about 3000 Bird watts or maybe a tad more...you would need one extra DC alternator and one AC alternator...
AC saves from running a truck load of batteries, but the high voltage is very dangerous...
Being that you are not to close to a tech, I would recommend you stay with DC amplifiers....
There has been a few people killed trying to work on their own AC stuff...
Dont want you to hurt yourself....
when ever you get the stuff ready to set up, just let me or us (cbradiotalk.com) know we can help ya....

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379 stringbean
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This thread

Post by 379 stringbean » Saturday, 22 December 2007, 22:40 PM

I'll tell you what,this thread here has probably been one of the more educating threads in quite some time.Thanx guys.


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Pillpopper
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Post by Pillpopper » Tuesday, 05 February 2008, 14:41 PM

I agree. Anyone still making them AC boxes anymore?

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Circuit Breaker
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Re: Done foolin' around

Post by Circuit Breaker » Tuesday, 05 February 2008, 14:56 PM

crazytruker wrote:Not so much for competition but for a mean skip talking mobile. Here is my dilemma...
If you're just talking about skip, you don't need the 1KW amp. It would be a waste of time really. A good radio and antenna is all you'll really need.

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yota167
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Oh yeh!

Post by yota167 » Tuesday, 05 February 2008, 15:20 PM

Dang, it's guys like this crazytrucker that kill me! I can't believe this post how awesome that he really wants to get to work on creating a wild mobile station like he's described! I like this forum :!:

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Post by Maverick » Wednesday, 26 March 2008, 18:45 PM

why not just setup a good DC mobile, and get a power inverter to run your browning?
Catch ya' Later Modulator!



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slydog
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Post by slydog » Wednesday, 26 March 2008, 19:03 PM

AC amps are dangerous propositions. Only people with a bunch of $$$$$$ and knowledge should ever mess with them. 3000-9000 volts can kill if you touch a cabinet with a slight ground while the alternators are turning.
Just about anything set up well in a ground plane mobile like a Suburban will be a skip talking keydown mobile.
With the price of gas now and in the future you probably want to Suburbans to those who have $$$$$$$$$$ burning a hole in their pocket.

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ww228kidd
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Post by ww228kidd » Wednesday, 26 March 2008, 19:10 PM

slydog wrote:AC amps are dangerous propositions. Only people with a bunch of $$$$$$ and knowledge should ever mess with them. 3000-9000 volts can kill if you touch a cabinet with a slight ground while the alternators are turning.
Just about anything set up well in a ground plane mobile like a Suburban will be a skip talking keydown mobile.
With the price of gas now and in the future you probably want to Suburbans to those who have $$$$$$$$$$ burning a hole in their pocket.
party true my friend, but it seems you have the right idea...lol its not the cabinets that will shock you while the engine is running...thw power supply cabinet will get you only if someone forgot to add the ground to it.... we have to test and tune all the time while the engine is running and even keying... just never stick your hands inside the cabinets or the power supplies unless you have shorted them out and added the ground strap accross the caps... then remove before starting back up...

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Post by Kojak » Monday, 03 November 2008, 18:45 PM


Well... I've ordered a few goodies to complement my existing setup so I can pump my junk up a little bit.

1 260A Alt. with a Delta quad-wound stator/external regulator (165A @ idle)
This Alt. has TWO internal fans for cooling. The diodes are rate @ 75A each.

3 6V Optima batteries (to be connected in series)

1 Predator 10K Single coil with 22" shaft.

1 Puck to mount the 10K.


NO MORE MUD DUCKING ! ! ! 8)


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